Curse

Dannzzigg · Jan 29, 2007, 03:06 AM // 03:06

Here's the deal...

I'm running on a 3 year old mobo (Chaintech VNF3-250) with only an AGP 8x/4x slot to work with.

I have/had an ATI Radeon 9800pro 128mb that was delivering around 50-60fps in GvG (not sure if what you are doing affects fps or not), but that card started getting a little freaky on me. It would change resolution on me just for fun, or the screen would go black, and other fun stuff. So i figured it was time to replace the card and go for something newer.

I first tried an x1600 that would not post at startup, even with just the gfx card as the only power draw (disconnected everything else). I flashed the mobo with the latest drivers (although they were dated 7/04, IIRC), but to no avail.

So, thinking maybe there was some sort of compatability issue with a card using DDR3, I swapped down to an x1300.

Same problem.

So... I am temporarily using a GeForce 6200 which is woefully slow compared to what I have gotten used to. But at least it works. In the Nvidia control panel, I have selected "let the application decide" for 3D settings. I am getting 20fps at best.

On top of all this, at the same time as getting the GeForce, I switched to a flatscreen LCD monitor.

So here are my questions...

1. Does the monitor have any effect on fps? I wouldn't think so, but I figured I'd ask, since I changed that at the same time.

2. more importantly, since my mobo apparently has some sort of conflict with the current generation of ATI cards (judging by the "no post" situation with the x1300 and x1600), what would be a decent card to deliver at least something near the 50-60 fps I've grown accustomed to, that might be workable on an older mobo?

I realize that not knowing the actual cause of the failure of the newer generation of cards to work might make this impossible to answer, but I figured there's no harm in asking.

A few other tidbits that may help... I cannot verify with certainty that the board is AGP 2.0, but from what I have managed to find on the web, the description of the slot is correct- Shorter division towards the front, longer towards the rear.

Is it possible for a card that requires AGP 2.0 to fit in an AGP slot that is only 1.0? I noticed that the 9800pro and the GeForce 6200 have three seperate section that actually fit into the slot on the board, but the newer cards I tried had two. They both fit just fine, but I wonder if that's the difference?

So... who want to take a crack at this one?

edit: one other thing I neglected to mention that might make a big difference, or might not- I was playing on an old CRT monitor at 1360x??? resolution. On the new flatpanel, I am playing at 1440x900

elzhar · Jan 29, 2007, 08:55 AM // 08:55

First of all the x1300 and x1600 are pci or pci-e, and since you have agp slots
those wont work.

If ur screen goes black its possible that the power supply unit isnt any good
anymore.

So with a new card in place, and the problems keep on coming ur best bet is to replace the power supply with a new one.

Corinthian · Jan 29, 2007, 09:09 AM // 09:09

R9800 Pro gives decent frame rate but for 50 - 60 I guess you need something close to the latest enthusiast model from either ATI or nVidia. But R9800 Pro is very cheap by now.

If it worked for you before just get a spanking new one and you're back in action. It should cost less than a new PSU. Monitor only affects when the refresh rate doesn't match the fps AND you're using vertical sync. Vsync limits the fps so that it matches the monitor refresh rate. For example, 50 fps on a 60 Hz monitor would be limited to 30 fps to match the refresh rate better.

Dannzzigg · Jan 31, 2007, 09:47 PM // 21:47

Thanks for the help, fellas. I originally asked because I couldn't find another 9800pro as they are apparently out of production, but I widened my search a bit and found one.

Incidentally, the 50-60 fps that I have grown accustomed to were acheived using the first 9800pro (the one I cooked).

Also, both the x1300 and x1600 are also available in AGP models. There is a difference between the portion of the card that fits into the AGP slot on the newer cards when compared to the older AGP cards though, and I'm wondering if that may be part of the compatability issue.

You can see the 9800pro here:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ShowIm...Card+ %2D+OEM

and the x1600 agp here:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ShowIm...ard+%2D+Retail

Since I may very well be looking to upgrade in the future, I'm wondering if anyone can give any insight as to why the cards with the extra division in the plug-in portion work in my mobo, while the others do not.

eggrolls · Jan 31, 2007, 11:35 PM // 23:35

A few years back when I actually considered getting an AGP card, I read somewhere that you have to be careful of the voltage difference of the various slots. 1x/2x = 3.3v, 4x = 1.5v, and 8x = 0.8v, iirc. So if you plug in a card that isn't compatible with the slot, it won't work. But then again, I thought most newer AGP cards are 8x/4x compatible, not just 8x.

Regarding the different "connectors", they're probably made that way to distinguish which voltage the card requires, 3.3, 1.5 or 0.8

The only other thing that came to mind was an inadequate power supply, but after some thought, that doesn't make any sense since the x1600 shouldn't draw more power than the 9800pro.

aeroclown · Feb 01, 2007, 05:16 PM // 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dannzzigg

Thanks for the help, fellas. I originally asked because I couldn't find another 9800pro as they are apparently out of production, but I widened my search a bit and found one.

Incidentally, the 50-60 fps that I have grown accustomed to were acheived using the first 9800pro (the one I cooked).

Also, both the x1300 and x1600 are also available in AGP models. There is a difference between the portion of the card that fits into the AGP slot on the newer cards when compared to the older AGP cards though, and I'm wondering if that may be part of the compatability issue.

You can see the 9800pro here:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ShowIm...Card+ %2D+OEM

and the x1600 agp here:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ShowIm...ard+%2D+Retail

Since I may very well be looking to upgrade in the future, I'm wondering if anyone can give any insight as to why the cards with the extra division in the plug-in portion work in my mobo, while the others do not.

The only difference between the PCI-E and AGP editions of these cards are the ability to use Crossfire. The AGP editions of the x1300 and 1600 do not support Crossfire. That is all.

I have an x1600 here in my agp slot and it works fine and dandy, keep in mind that there is a minimum requirement of a 300 watt PSU. If you have anything lower you can forget the card working, in fact you probably should have something more in the 350 to 450 range for any new high end card, regardless of if the card is agp or not.

I do not believe there are any issues with AGP slot voltages anymore as most of the boards that have these slots are 8x max anyway, and if the card is not capable most mother boards are smart enough to know how to step down for compatibility, usually all the way to the 1.x series. The 9800 pro however if I am not mistaken is an 8x capable card, indicating that if it was functioning there should be no issue at all with any new card that is AGP unless the slot is failing. You can also usually check settings within the bios to ensure compatibility on some makes and models.

Most of the X series require an external power source, you must ensure that you plug in a 3 pin power connector on the top Edge of the card. If you do not the card will also fail to function in most cases, in circumstance in which it does not fail it will show signs of other problems in game play and active use. The Connector is not your usual flat or stacked 4 Pin Power Molex Connector, it is a smaller flat 3 Pin Power Molex Connector aka the power connector you might use for a floppy drive or media bay.